Calling out Byron (politely)

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Nekhrun
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Postby Nekhrun » 12 Sep 2008 14:53

Serkanner wrote:How pathetic can you become. If it was up to me, which it isn't, he would just get his ass kicked from here for the sole reason I find him an moron without any decent sense of what literature is.

may I quote:

"
I'm reading an ARC copy of Paul of Dune, and I think it's the best thing Brian and KJA have written. Amazing!"

I will not even bother looking for that other ridiculous statement of "getting their prose into high gear".

Without having read it, I think that it is very likely the best thing those two have ever written. How could it not be? All they'd have to do this time is try a little bit. When the sum total of all their books is shit, it wouldn't take a whole lot to include at least one good line, or find one from somewhere and rip it off.

I can't wait to read their latest attempt.

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Postby Ampoliros » 12 Sep 2008 15:08

again My goodbye to DN. I'm posting it here and on T(A)U to preserve it from deletion:

I love the Irony that the HLP embodies everything Frank said about power structures that inherit power from a charismatic source. If he was here today, this is what he'd have to say about the HLP.

Image

Well, so much for my attempt at being civil. All's fair in flames and banning, as they say.

Sand will cover this forum, sand will cover KJA. One blasphemy remains and the blasphemy is the HLP's attempts to censor this community.

Seriously, if the HLP had put forth any fluid response with the Dune community then this would not be happening now.

A serious author, a serious attempt at continuing Dune would not have invoked the wrath of all of the OH community; yes some would still be mad, but if the HLP had given us the smallest hint that they were concerned about what we though of Dune, most of us would have been placated. Instead, it seems we are told, 'Shut up, we have the rights, your job is to take this trash and love it'.

Too bad Frank showed us how to better think for ourselves and proclaimed a universe led by no one man's vision. The attempt to convert a great piece of American Literature and speculative thought into manufactured cash is EXACTLY the reason that our country and our world are in such dire straits at this point in history. We can be cowards, and ignore sacrilege against humanity. Or we can pass the Gom Jabbar of our time and stand up against hollow rules that attempt to subdue us. I do not lay all the woes of the world at the feet of the HLP. But I do accuse them of helping to build those walls that encapsulate us.

I can understand from their point of view, that Frank left them a great inheritance, and i don't believe for a second that Frank didn't mean for them to profit off of it as he had. But I do believe that he would be saddened at how quickly they cheapened and perverted that inheritance.
Dune is a "Manual on Humanity" as I describe it to friends and new fans. The new "books" do nothing to honor that legacy short of proving completely how right he was about inherited power.

To the HLP. Only you can save Dune from what you have made it into. The Orthodox Herbertians will always be with you. I would suggest you listen to them. History is on our side, that is not under dispute, there is no way the new 'books' will ever be accepted as canon as long as the entire spirit of those 'writings' is soley the spirit of monetary profit. I WANT YOU TO MAKE MONEY OFF DUNE. I bought the originals to support Frank. I would not be here now if his words had not touched me in a way i describe as a spiritual experience. Dune is more than the money it made, more than the awards it won, and more than the lively hood it made for Frank. It is a Truth, one which was so profound that its creator had to publicly proclaim he was not trying to start a new religion.

It is a pity that the winds of deletion will cover my words. To those who know them, to those who understand them, they are written in stone, they are written in the human spirit, and that cannot be deleted and cannot be ignored.
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Re: Calling out Byron (politely)

Postby Ampoliros » 12 Sep 2008 15:16

Simon wrote:
Lundse wrote:First of all, I think it is pretty damn brave to come here. For any KJA&BH fan/defender. Period.


Thanks, but I feel like Ice-T in that movie where Rugter Hauer hunts him for sport. SandChigger is like Gary Busey in that flick. :shock: :lol:


You're good people Simon. Even if you like the new...ugh... :vomit:
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Simon
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Postby Simon » 12 Sep 2008 15:59

Back at ya man. Dune people is my people! :)
(even if we can't agree :lol: )

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Nekhrun
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Postby Nekhrun » 12 Sep 2008 16:04

Simon wrote:Back at ya man. Dune people is my people! :)
(even if we can't agree :lol: )

You'll come around. :wink:

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Postby Mandy » 12 Sep 2008 16:07

Byron will never post anything here against the new novels, he has already proved that. I would love to know what his honest opinion is, but I'm not holding my breath.

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Postby Ampoliros » 12 Sep 2008 16:15

I agree, I'd love to have an honest chat with the man away from his "duties". We might have to get him drunk to get his honest opinion.

I think being the doorman between us and the HLP hasn't been easy.

Byron, take a vacation, recover your sanity and let someone else hold the fort! (or better yet just leave the door open for a few days :twisted: )
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Postby Lisan Al-Gaib » 12 Sep 2008 20:24

Frybread wrote:Lundse, the problem is Byron has banned just about everyone who disagrees with his opinion of the new Dune books, even posters who have been polite.

It doesn't matter if you refrain from using personal attacks or foul language, if you express displeasure with PoD or any of the prequels or sequels he bans you. That is why, IMO, he does not deserve respect.


Even before my banishment, I respected Byron, even deeply disliking BH&KJA work.

However, nowadays I'm banned from the forum that I'm in for about two years, where I haven't spoke a single bad word.

Now, someone tell me: What I have to think about Byron?

***

I have made this statement in the PM I had sent to him when I had been banned:

Hello Byron,

I'm PM you because I would like to know somethings.

I have been posting and making part of the DN for more than 2 years. DN was the first time I entered in a international forum. And there, after I reading all Franks Dune book, and during my reading of House Atreides, and all post I could get, I develop my own opinions about the original and the new books.

But one thing my I learn in life and I never lost is respect and to be respectful with any person. And is that what always tried to do in the DN forum, where the discussion become so hot with a lot of different opinions.

I never loose my respect for you too. When I entered in the forum I was very excited for you be the voice from your family and from the new about the new Dune movie. I was excited because is really fantastic to know a person who knew one of your greatest idol.

Well, sadly, we don't share the same opinions about the duniverse, the new books or about even the future of the physics. But I always followed of what you and the others was writing, and tried once more post with respect. I never post too much (because i'm little lazy to write in English), but what I thought I could contribute, I posted.

So, the thing I would like to really know is why you banned me from the DN. I liked to read that forum when I get home from the work.
That is the only think I have to ask (not the only, but you understand =P).

Thanks,
Lisan.


So, the answer is already known: He banned me for the "fuckers" I said here. A word written at the heat of the anger of what they had written in the first PoD chapter. A strong word (Now I know), but posted to make my angry statement at Jacurutu, not DN.

That is the post that motivated Byron to ban me:
link: http://www.jacurutu.com/viewtopic.php?p ... ght=#17744

***

Again: What I have to think about you, Byron?
The singular multiplicity of this universe draws my deepest attention. It is a thing of ultimate beauty.

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Postby Lundse » 12 Sep 2008 21:27

TheDukester wrote:Byron's most recent effort here:

http://www.jacurutu.com/viewtopic.php?p ... ght=#12530

A bizarre, in-your-face, out-of-nowhere, unasked-for rant about how cool the Two Dune-Rapers are and how many useless industry awards they've been nominated for.

If that is going to be his level of contribution around here, then I don't miss him at all.

I'm still baffled by your level of concern about this whole subject. Post something over at his little fiefdom if you want to have a "discussion" with him.

Just prepare for it to be deleted, of course. :roll:


That is actually why I would like a discussion to be possible (also in a no-one-is-attacking-you-personally-at-the-same-time sort of way) - Byron is one of the few KJA fans who has been willing to try to discuss matters and at the same time, I feel the ice is rather thin over at DN...

I agree that the 'contribution' you link to is worthless qua discussions, but to be fair, so is the dune demotivators and numerous posts and speculations here about the HLP, KJA, BH, etc. (though I enjoy the latter more than ads and blurbs).

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Postby Lundse » 12 Sep 2008 21:29

A Thing of Eternity wrote:I'm going to have to agree with Lundse on this so far, I personally would rather be able to argue with Byron than have him ignore us and us fling insults at someone who isn't listening. I get much more satisfaction out of me taking the high road and arguing well and him derailing subjects, resorting to insults and generally humiliating himself on topics he clearly doesn't understand at all (Dominos Vs Byron FTL debate) - way more satisfaction that I get from the times I just insult him. Nothing can ever quite match the fun I have debating with him and watching him scramble to derail the topic because he knows he'll loose.

And Teg, don't worry about Lundse, he hates new Dune as much or more than any of us. He just hasn't had enough time with Byron yet to form any real opinions, let him have that time and I'm sure he'll come to the same conclusions you (and I) have. I've always said one of the more idiotic things a person can do is base their opinion of a person on someone else's opinion of that person. Let Lundse form his own for his own reasons.

EDIT: And yes, Byron is a worthless yesman in my opinion, but I prefer to watch him proove that rather than just say it.


Hehe - thanks, I guess. And I have experienced the banning, censorship and derailments firsthand. I am just a sucker for 'one more chance' and, as you say, letting people prove their worth (or lack thereof) before judging them.

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Postby Seraphan » 12 Sep 2008 21:36

To be honest and to post my personal opinion, i'm getting tired of giving byron/BH/KJA atention in whatever degree. I love the novels written by Frank Herbert and that's something i like to talk about with some people. I have been getting caried away in hatred for what they're doing and you know what? They are not worth it!
Everyone here knows my opinion about BH and KJA so there's really no point in me repeating the same thing over and over again.

I like the way Frank wrotte because of the realism he put into it, the characters feel real, the environment feals real and the emotions that are carried in the narrative are real.
I'm going to spend more time around the Reading Group section, since i'm re-reading children of dune and all, so i'll be posting questions and other stuff related to that. So to close my statement:
1- Anyone that calls me an Orthodox Herbeterian like i'm some kind of religious zealot can go fuck itself with a pointy object.
2- Anyone that tries pitching to me that KJA is an awsome writter will get fucked with a pointy object.
3- I'm a reader, i like to read good literature with meaningfull content and any other kind of book gets fucked with a pointy object.
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Postby TheDukester » 12 Sep 2008 21:56

Lundse wrote:That is actually why I would like a discussion to be possible ...

You can keep bringing this up, but you're in the wrong venue. Byron clearly has no interest in interacting with this site in any way. End of story.
"Anything I write will be remembered and listed in bibliographies on Dune for several hundred years ..." — some delusional halfwit troll.

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Postby Frybread » 12 Sep 2008 22:21

TheDukester wrote:
Lundse wrote:That is actually why I would like a discussion to be possible ...

You can keep bringing this up, but you're in the wrong venue. Byron clearly has no interest in interacting with this site in any way. End of story.


From Lisan's story, the only reason Byron visits Jacurutu is to look for users he can ban from DN.

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Postby Rakis » 12 Sep 2008 22:44

Mr. Teg wrote:
Lundse wrote:Hey, he has censored me too.

Image

But if he tries to engage in a discussion, I will try my damnedst not to let it deteriorate. If nothing else, then out of respect for the discussion.

I think it is admirable that he comes here to discuss matters, especially if they include the things he cannot discuss 'back home' for his employer.

Image

In fact, if that is his intention, it disproves the 'pussy' theory of why he deletes valid discussions at dunenovels.com


He never came here to discuss matters.
(Again you're way behind current events)[/img]


BEST POST IN THIS THREAD :)

I do believe Byron had some pressure from the HLP to clean the DNBBS board, but the way he did it and the words that came with it are HIS own...

He's banning people like he cleans shit...

He and Johnny-on-the-spot Hyppo DESERVE each other...
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Postby Nekhrun » 13 Sep 2008 01:35

Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:So, the answer is already known: He banned me for the "fuckers" I said here. A word written at the heat of the anger of what they had written in the first PoD chapter. A strong word (Now I know), but posted to make my angry statement at Jacurutu, not DN.

We've almost all used the word fuckers here. Did he tell you that was the reason? I assumed that he banned you because you posted a link to illegal copies of Dune books.

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Postby chanilover » 13 Sep 2008 04:14

Why does anyone care what Byron really thinks? He laughed and joked around with us all on Dunenovels then one day, out of nowhere, he just started the bannings.

Oh well, shit happens.
"You and your buddies and that b*tch Mandy are nothing but a gang of lying, socially maladjusted losers." - St Hypatia of Arrakeen.
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Postby Lisan Al-Gaib » 13 Sep 2008 15:05

Nekhrun wrote:
Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:So, the answer is already known: He banned me for the "fuckers" I said here. A word written at the heat of the anger of what they had written in the first PoD chapter. A strong word (Now I know), but posted to make my angry statement at Jacurutu, not DN.

We've almost all used the word fuckers here. Did he tell you that was the reason? I assumed that he banned you because you posted a link to illegal copies of Dune books.


I thought it was that too. I had already deleted the link because I was thinking that.

But he answered me talking only about the word "fucker", so I assumed that is the reason.

Chanilover wrote:Why does anyone care what Byron really thinks? He laughed and joked around with us all on Dunenovels then one day, out of nowhere, he just started the bannings.
Oh well, shit happens.


I agree with you. However I wouldn't like if someone without strong reason canceled my newspaper's delivery, and if now on I couldn't sent any letter to that newspaper. That is my felling about what happened at DN forum.
Last edited by Lisan Al-Gaib on 13 Sep 2008 21:23, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby Freakzilla » 13 Sep 2008 18:19

Ampoliros wrote:I agree, I'd love to have an honest chat with the man away from his "duties". We might have to get him drunk to get his honest opinion.

I think being the doorman between us and the HLP hasn't been easy.

Byron, take a vacation, recover your sanity and let someone else hold the fort! (or better yet just leave the door open for a few days :twisted: )


I think he should make me a moderator. :)
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Postby inhuien » 13 Sep 2008 19:40

I'd second that! :)

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Postby A Thing of Eternity » 13 Sep 2008 20:55

Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:
Nekhrun wrote:
Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:So, the answer is already known: He banned me for the "fuckers" I said here. A word written at the heat of the anger of what they had written in the first PoD chapter. A strong word (Now I know), but posted to make my angry statement at Jacurutu, not DN.

We've almost all used the word fuckers here. Did he tell you that was the reason? I assumed that he banned you because you posted a link to illegal copies of Dune books.


I thought it was that too. I had already deleted the link think that.

But he answered me talking only about the word "fucker", so I assumed that is the reason.

Chanilover wrote:Why does anyone care what Byron really thinks? He laughed and joked around with us all on Dunenovels then one day, out of nowhere, he just started the bannings.
Oh well, shit happens.


I agree with you. However I wouldn't like if someone without strong reason canceled my newspaper's delivery, and if now on I couldn't sent any letter to that newspaper. That is my felling about what happened at DN forum.


I think he banned you because he was pissed at Dominos/Me and he didn't want an astrophysicist telling everyone he was wrong on his board so he went hunting over here to see if he could find anything to ban you for.
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Postby Freakzilla » 14 Sep 2008 06:45

That's how it seems.
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Postby Ampoliros » 14 Sep 2008 11:54

we need a little badge we can add under our avatar here:
BFT, Banned for Truth.
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Postby SandChigger » 14 Sep 2008 13:10

Yawn.

I think I declared Byron irrelevant A LONG TIME AGO.

Who gives a flying fuck about what the shill thinks?

As I believe Omph has pointed out, he flirted with us for over a year, hinting that he might have a REAL opinion about the books, maybe something like our own. But when it came down to it, he threw his lot in with the rest of the family in selling out Grampa's life work.

Treat him like the cheap whore he is: screw 'im and forget him.
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Re: Calling out Byron (politely)

Postby SandChigger » 14 Sep 2008 13:12

Simon wrote:Thanks, but I feel like Ice-T in that movie where Rugter Hauer hunts him for sport. SandChigger is like Gary Busey in that flick. :shock: :lol:

Haven't seen it and therefore don't get the reference, but fuck you, too, as appropriate.
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Postby Lundse » 14 Sep 2008 14:25

Rakis wrote:
Mr. Teg wrote:
Lundse wrote:Hey, he has censored me too.

Image

But if he tries to engage in a discussion, I will try my damnedst not to let it deteriorate. If nothing else, then out of respect for the discussion.

I think it is admirable that he comes here to discuss matters, especially if they include the things he cannot discuss 'back home' for his employer.

Image

In fact, if that is his intention, it disproves the 'pussy' theory of why he deletes valid discussions at dunenovels.com


He never came here to discuss matters.
(Again you're way behind current events)[/img]


BEST POST IN THIS THREAD :)


So you believe a call for civil discussion should be subjected to ridicule, sprinkled with lies (I have linked to on-topic posts by Byron here)?