Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

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Cpt. Aramsham
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Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Cpt. Aramsham » 19 Aug 2019 10:44

I expect this post may get me banned here :twisted:, but hear me out:

Brian Herbert was born June 29, 1947, so he turned 12 in 1959.

Frank Herbert has been working on the book that would become Dune, and around 1959 he decides to add another character: Duke Leto's 12-year-old son, Barri. He soon changes the name to Paul, but notice the similarity of the original names: Brian, Barri…

Frank gets stuck on the writing until he fires his agent in November 1961. After that he makes quick progress over the following months, writing and revising throughout 1962 and into 1963. Brian turns 15 in 1962, and in the early drafts of the first chapter, presumably written around this time, we see that Frank changes Paul's age, from "almost twelve" to "already fifteen."

Coincidence? Hardly!
There is only one explanation: Brian Herbert is the Kwisatz Haderach!

(Still, one must ask: What is the son but an extension of the father?)

georgiedenbro
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby georgiedenbro » 19 Aug 2019 13:19

Crazy theory. In this case it seems the sleeper stayed asleep.
"um-m-m-ah-h-h-hm-m-m-m!"

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Nekhrun
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Nekhrun » 20 Aug 2019 11:49

georgiedenbro wrote:In this case it seems the sleeper stayed asleep.

:clap:
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lotek
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby lotek » 23 Aug 2019 14:57

Nekhrun wrote:
georgiedenbro wrote:In this case it seems the sleeper stayed asleep.

:clap:

Hey Nek!
Hope all is good with you :)

Cpt. Aramsham wrote:I expect this post may get me banned here :twisted:, but hear me out:

Brian Herbert was born June 29, 1947, so he turned 12 in 1959.

Frank Herbert has been working on the book that would become Dune, and around 1959 he decides to add another character: Duke Leto's 12-year-old son, Barri. He soon changes the name to Paul, but notice the similarity of the original names: Brian, Barri…

Frank gets stuck on the writing until he fires his agent in November 1961. After that he makes quick progress over the following months, writing and revising throughout 1962 and into 1963. Brian turns 15 in 1962, and in the early drafts of the first chapter, presumably written around this time, we see that Frank changes Paul's age, from "almost twelve" to "already fifteen."

Coincidence? Hardly!
There is only one explanation: Brian Herbert is the Kwisatz Haderach!

(Still, one must ask: What is the son but an extension of the father?)


I didn't know about Barri, did you find this in Road to Dune?
(also the ban hammer has a very high treshold so I think you're quite safe)
And out of context it would make sense for a writer to be inspired by his own son when writing about father/son relationship so it's not something impossible to fathom.

But that KH failed.
Spice is the worm's gonads.

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Cpt. Aramsham
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Cpt. Aramsham » 24 Aug 2019 08:00

lotek wrote:I didn't know about Barri, did you find this in Road to Dune?

Yes, but the name is also found on at least one page of notes in the Fullerton collection that has been publicly posted. A phone number jotted down in the middle of a draft that must be later (see p. 8 here — note that the handwritten draft written on the back of the pages is much later than the outline on the front, and you can tell it's later than the one-pager because it has "Harkonnen" rather than "Hoskanner" on p. 2/E5) makes it possible to date that draft to the period when the Herberts were living in Stockton, CA: from early 1959 to early 1960.

(The one-pager could potentially be earlier, in theory as early as 1957, but Frank always said he spent several years doing research before he started writing, and I think the most likely case is that the two documents are from relatively close together in time: within a few months.)

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Freakzilla
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Sep 2019 17:48

Cpt. Aramsham wrote:I expect this post may get me banned here :twisted:, but hear me out:


I hope you know better than that. I started this sietch because of censorship at Dunenovels.com
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Freakzilla
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Sep 2019 17:50

Could Barri have been Bruce?
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Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
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Cpt. Aramsham
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Re: Brian Herbert is Paul Atreides!

Postby Cpt. Aramsham » 02 Sep 2019 06:18

Freakzilla wrote:
Cpt. Aramsham wrote:I expect this post may get me banned here :twisted:, but hear me out:


I hope you know better than that. I started this sietch because of censorship at Dunenovels.com

It was in the way of being a joke. :P

Freakzilla wrote:Could Barri have been Bruce?

Perhaps, but the ages don't line up as well. Bruce was 4 years younger than Brian, so he'd be 8 and 11 at the times in question. However, in The Road to Dune, Brian and Kevin do state that Barri was 8 in one version of the story (which must be an earlier version), so who knows? Since Brian was already 10 in 1957 when Frank did the "Stop the Moving Sands" flight over Florence, OR, there's no way to align him with an 8-year-old version of the character.