What Do We REALLY Know About Brian Herbert And The HLP?

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orald
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Postby orald » 23 Jul 2008 14:41

Oh God, I hope you don't assemble to some giant pink robot. :shock:


I'm like who, Chig? Who have I killed? Who have I bombed?

I'm just sorry your Indians...err, "native americans" don't bomb you day and night for actually stealing their lands, unlike what happened here(oh yea, BTW, we've been immigrating and buying lands legally over a century ago...under later attacks by the same sellers).
It doesn't get old, you're all just too far removed and comfortable to care.

Go eat your sushi, Chig.
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

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SandChigger
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Postby SandChigger » 23 Jul 2008 18:55

No, stupid, what I meant was that you're just as full of hate as the people you hate, so drop the "poor little innocent (victim) me" routine.

And it is old, and boring.

But you're right, if your silly millennia-OLD claim to the "Holy Land" is considered valid, then no land rights in any country are safe. (Buying, selling, blah blah blah. The land was never theirs to sell, no? So who are the fools for paying them for it?)


(Thanks for the lunch suggestion, but I've already bought sandwiches today. Maybe tomorrow.)
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Postby Phaedrus » 23 Jul 2008 21:31

orald wrote:I'm just sorry your Indians...err, "native americans" don't bomb you day and night for actually stealing their lands, unlike what happened here


Interesting commentary on the relative civilization of cultures, doncha think?

You Middle Easterns could take some lessons from our natives.
You aren't thinking or really existing unless you're willing to risk even your own sanity in the judgment of your existence.

HoosierDaddy

Postby HoosierDaddy » 23 Jul 2008 23:13

I've already proposed the solution to the middle east problems. Make Israel/Palastine the 51st US state.

1. Total separation of religion and state, and freedoms granted by the US constitution.
2. Take all the foreign aid for war, and build infrastructure (schools, electricity, etc).
3. No US corporate taxes (like Puerto Rico used to have) to spur industry.
4. Open borders, and the ability to visit or immigrate.
5. Israel gets rid of all their nukes.

Think about all the money the US and other nations spend defending/fighting in the middle east. Spend a portion of that on rebuilding and industrializing the region, and most of the problems go away, in years, not decades.

So what happens if Iran wants in on the party? Great. They can help build factories and hospitals too. What if Iran gets pissed off? Then they fight the US straight out, with no Hizballah shadow boxing. The Palastinians don't need Hamas if they have jobs, freedom, and security.


:smoke:

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SimonH
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Postby SimonH » 24 Jul 2008 01:02

Didn't Israel just march into Palestine and take it over, even though it was not it in the allotted region post WW2?

If so, maybe we should have cared more back then.

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Postby SandChigger » 24 Jul 2008 03:18

It's a bit more complicated than that, actually.

The British and, later, the UN were involved...always the parties to call if you want to fuck things up nicely. And the Arabs were being assholes and generally throwing wrenches into the works. And don't forget the Jewish terrorist factions.

The whole Palestian Problem comes from several hundred thousand Arab inhabitants of the area getting spooked and fleeing out of fear when Israel was founded (the surrounding Arab countries had attacked and there was a war going on) and then not being allowed to return.

Had they sat still and stayed put, things might not be quite the idiotic mess they are now; many of the Jewish groups were amenable to coexistence. But the Israelis can't really let them come back now because Jewish refugees from around the world were resettled in the places abandonned by the Arabs.

It's a really sad story, with no shortage of stupidity on either side. And neither side is completely innocent or less culpable than the other.
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Postby SimonH » 24 Jul 2008 04:20

glad it is not that simple. every generation thinks they are doing the right thing and achieve major fuck ups by the looks of it.

I wonder if the net effect of the iraq invasion/expungement-of-saddam will be positive for the middle east.

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Postby orald » 24 Jul 2008 04:54

phaedrus wrote:You Middle Easterns could take some lessons from our natives.

If memory serves, your natives were quite hostile sometimes, but yea, the Arabs could learn alot from the Indians.
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.



I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

Fantômas

Postby Fantômas » 24 Jul 2008 06:58

HoosierDaddy wrote:I've already proposed the solution to the middle east problems. Make Israel/Palastine the 51st US state.

1. Total separation of religion and state, and freedoms granted by the US constitution.
2. Take all the foreign aid for war, and build infrastructure (schools, electricity, etc).
3. No US corporate taxes (like Puerto Rico used to have) to spur industry.
4. Open borders, and the ability to visit or immigrate.
5. Israel gets rid of all their nukes.

Think about all the money the US and other nations spend defending/fighting in the middle east. Spend a portion of that on rebuilding and industrializing the region, and most of the problems go away, in years, not decades.

So what happens if Iran wants in on the party? Great. They can help build factories and hospitals too. What if Iran gets pissed off? Then they fight the US straight out, with no Hizballah shadow boxing. The Palastinians don't need Hamas if they have jobs, freedom, and security.


:smoke:

These are good solutions to the problems; Jews will never go for it.
Doesn't the expenditures in bellic material fuel the economy thru weapons manufacturers. I wonder what the real bottom line is.

Hasta luego.

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Lisan Al-Gaib
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Postby Lisan Al-Gaib » 24 Jul 2008 10:12

HoosierDaddy wrote:I've already proposed the solution to the middle east problems. Make Israel/Palastine the 51st US state.

1. Total separation of religion and state, and freedoms granted by the US constitution.
2. Take all the foreign aid for war, and build infrastructure (schools, electricity, etc).
3. No US corporate taxes (like Puerto Rico used to have) to spur industry.
4. Open borders, and the ability to visit or immigrate.
5. Israel gets rid of all their nukes.

Think about all the money the US and other nations spend defending/fighting in the middle east. Spend a portion of that on rebuilding and industrializing the region, and most of the problems go away, in years, not decades.

So what happens if Iran wants in on the party? Great. They can help build factories and hospitals too. What if Iran gets pissed off? Then they fight the US straight out, with no Hizballah shadow boxing. The Palastinians don't need Hamas if they have jobs, freedom, and security.


:smoke:


You are showing all the points that make the majority of the other country's population hate the american diplomacy....Noone want to be colonized again.

Even poor, the other countries want their liberty, their own laws and "way of life".
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Postby Mr. Teg » 24 Jul 2008 10:58

A member of my soccer team in college was Palestinian and he explained that they hate the Jordanians as much as the Israelis.

But Chig is right, stupidity on all sides exploited by the British.
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Postby Freakzilla » 24 Jul 2008 11:18

I blame my parents.
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HoosierDaddy

Postby HoosierDaddy » 24 Jul 2008 12:05

Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:You are showing all the points that make the majority of the other country's population hate the american diplomacy....Noone want to be colonized again.

Even poor, the other countries want their liberty, their own laws and "way of life".


I'm not saying we just go in and take over. Like Puerto Rico, we put statehood to a vote.

I'm proposing this with a little tongue in cheek, but it's been 60 years now. Every outbreak of violence means another generation lost to hatred and war.

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Postby Mr. Teg » 24 Jul 2008 17:08

Freakzilla wrote:I blame my parents.


Exactly! Ship 'em out :D
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Postby Freakzilla » 24 Jul 2008 17:42

HoosierDaddy wrote:
Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:You are showing all the points that make the majority of the other country's population hate the american diplomacy....Noone want to be colonized again.

Even poor, the other countries want their liberty, their own laws and "way of life".


I'm not saying we just go in and take over. Like Puerto Rico, we put statehood to a vote.

I'm proposing this with a little tongue in cheek, but it's been 60 years now. Every outbreak of violence means another generation lost to hatred and war.


They've got hot chicks in PR!
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Postby Omphalos » 24 Jul 2008 19:19

HoosierDaddy wrote:
Lisan Al-Gaib wrote:You are showing all the points that make the majority of the other country's population hate the american diplomacy....Noone want to be colonized again.

Even poor, the other countries want their liberty, their own laws and "way of life".


I'm not saying we just go in and take over. Like Puerto Rico, we put statehood to a vote.

I'm proposing this with a little tongue in cheek, but it's been 60 years now. Every outbreak of violence means another generation lost to hatred and war.


Wait a minute..If this is only a "little" tongue in cheek, then you are partly serious? This has got to be the fucking stupidest idea I have ever heard of. You really mean this, at least partly? Because you are defending it like you are.

HoosierDaddy

Postby HoosierDaddy » 24 Jul 2008 20:42

Omphalos wrote:Wait a minute..If this is only a "little" tongue in cheek, then you are partly serious? This has got to be the fucking stupidest idea I have ever heard of. You really mean this, at least partly? Because you are defending it like you are.


I say it a little tongue in cheek because no US leader would have the guts to propose it.

Now, lets hear why this is a stupid fucking idea.

:?:

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Postby SandChigger » 24 Jul 2008 21:09

I'd drather (there's another one!) annex Canada and declare open season on women of Scandanavian descent with canes.

:twisted:
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Postby Mr. Teg » 24 Jul 2008 21:25

SandChigger wrote:I'd drather (there's another one!) annex Canada and declare open season on women of Scandanavian descent with canes.

:twisted:


Wait a minute!? I thought Canada already was the 51st state :wink:
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Postby A Thing of Eternity » 24 Jul 2008 21:31

Mr. Teg wrote:
SandChigger wrote:I'd drather (there's another one!) annex Canada and declare open season on women of Scandanavian descent with canes.

:twisted:


Wait a minute!? I thought Canada already was the 51st state :wink:


51st through 63rd to be precise :wink:
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Postby SandChigger » 24 Jul 2008 21:55

Yeah, but 61 through 63, inclusive, are that scuzzy Scandi woman's bum. :wink:
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Postby Phaedrus » 24 Jul 2008 22:09

No, no, no. You guys have it all wrong. North America is separated into Mexico, Jesusland, and the United States of Canada. Duh.

I say it a little tongue in cheek because no US leader would have the guts to propose it.

Now, lets hear why this is a stupid fucking idea.


It wouldn't solve anything.

It would require a massive military force to occupy/tame the Middle East(do you think they'd join the infidels VOLUNTARILY? Ha.).

It's a major breach of about a thousand U.S. and international laws, I'm sure.

I can't even begin to describe the horrible problems with cultural and language differences.

No one in the U.S. or in the Middle East, or Europe, or anywhere else on the planet would approve of it. It's massively flawed in so many ways, I can't believe you seriously think it would solve any of the problems that already exist, instead of escalating the violence and insanity to new levels.
You aren't thinking or really existing unless you're willing to risk even your own sanity in the judgment of your existence.

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Postby Omphalos » 24 Jul 2008 22:11

HoosierDaddy wrote:
Omphalos wrote:Wait a minute..If this is only a "little" tongue in cheek, then you are partly serious? This has got to be the fucking stupidest idea I have ever heard of. You really mean this, at least partly? Because you are defending it like you are.


I say it a little tongue in cheek because no US leader would have the guts to propose it.

Now, lets hear why this is a stupid fucking idea.

:?:


You think its a good idea to have an American State in a region that is absolutely sure to be attacked by one or more extremely hostile nations, at any time? What do you think Congress would do if the "51st state" were to be attacked by rockets, tanks and infantry from Syria? Or Lebanon? Or Egypt? Or all of them? Because that has happened in recent memory. I cant even believe I'm discussing this ridiculous idea. Making it a state will not foster peace in any way. As a matter of fact, it would probably make attacks more likely. The last thing anyone in the world wants is America with a blood vendetta to appease over the death of its citizens. I think we have already had that recently, and look where its gotten us.

And you propose this why? A nation that would be a security and resource hog and not give us the GDP even of Louisiana, would probably guarantee war with the rest of the entire region, that would certainly be an enormous fiscal drain to manage due to its distance, and in the end would probably get us into some conflict that would be more likely than anything else we have seen in the past to escalate into all out, declared war? Why is this a good idea again?

And I did not even go into the Israeli's reactions to this idea. I'm not sure that I could put into words the ridicule they would probably think it deserves.

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Postby Omphalos » 24 Jul 2008 22:14

A Thing of Eternity wrote:
Mr. Teg wrote:
SandChigger wrote:I'd drather (there's another one!) annex Canada and declare open season on women of Scandanavian descent with canes.

:twisted:


Wait a minute!? I thought Canada already was the 51st state :wink:


51st through 63rd to be precise :wink:


Forget Nunavut. Nobody here can even pronounce it.

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Postby GamePlayer » 24 Jul 2008 22:44

Sarcasm about our newest politically correct northern territory? I'll have None-of-it! Nunavut, I say! :)