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    The Eyes of Heisenberg

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      Non-Dune Frank Herbert Book Discussion

    Moderators: Omphalos, Freakzilla, ᴶᵛᵀᴬ, Mr. Teg

    The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 21 Apr 2008 16:31

    Just found a nice vintage copy of this and started reading it yesterday. Will post my thoughts when finished.
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    Postby orald » 21 Apr 2008 17:31

    I remember it was quite nice, but vague on the messages it was delivering(read it almost a decade ago). Something about biology triumphs over man-made restrictions?
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Postby A Thing of Eternity » 25 Apr 2008 13:47

    This turned out to be a pretty good book, bit thin on character development compared to some of FH's other work, but had decent characterization over-all compared to some other authors. Good plotting, good world building. Had alot of FH's signature 'excessivly in depth science' when talking about the gene engineering, very similar in style to Destination: Void. Whether any of the chemical processes and such FH discusses in this book are realistic I have no idea, not my area of expertise, and it was 40 years ago, so much of wht we know about DNA engineering today may have changed (again I don't know). I thought his depiction of immortal phsychology was very interesting, and probably much more realistic than what other authors have attempted on the subject. I don't think the message was so much that 'biology triumphs over man-made restrictions', if that means biology will fight back against what we do to it. It seemed to me much more like FH was saying that nature has billions of years of trial and error over us, and no matter how smart we may think we are we cannot make changes to the genome (and as a metaphor - the ecosytems of earth) that will function the way we think they will, and it is therefor safer to leave it be altogether.
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    Postby orald » 26 Apr 2008 01:32

    He always seems to point out in the Duniverse(and some in the begining of Dosadi) that machines and artificial constructs can't predict the changing life's needs and thus can't be relied upon for survival.

    That was more what I meant to say- that human constructs(such as to manipulate genes and stick the population in the same spot for easier control in this here book) will fail because of the unpredictability of the universe.
    In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

    I wish I could have been with you that one last time.
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby reverendmotherQ. » 03 Oct 2010 10:59

    A Thing of Eternity wrote:Just found a nice vintage copy of this and started reading it yesterday. Will post my thoughts when finished.

    I am reading it now! It's amazing! I'm rooting for the couple all the way while they are navigating through all of the medical personnel.
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby Apjak » 08 Nov 2010 09:31

    I sat down and read this yesterday. I enjoyed it quite a bit. I've worked through quite a few FH non-dune books this year, and I have to say, I think I've taken a big step with this one towards FH's thought process. The last one's I read of his where Dragon in the Sea, and The Santaroga Barrier. It's interesting to see so many specific theme's re-represented throughout his works. Listening to his interviews, have also helped quite a bit too. I think it's about time for a Dune series re-read, probably early next year. I just have a different perspective now on THE MAN, and I'm confident that the Dune series will be even richer for it, but part of me feels that it will be more transparent. I'm not so psyched about a re-read with even less mystery.

    Anyhow, Eyes of Heisenberg... :handgestures-thumbupleft:
    I don't think the author should make the reader do that much work - Kevin J. Anderson
    We think we've updated 'Dune' for a modern readership without dumbing it down.- Brian Herbert
    There’s an unwritten compact between you and the reader. If someone enters a bookstore and sets down hard earned money(energy) for your book, you owe that person some entertainment and as much more as you can give. - Frank Herbert
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg (spoilers)

    Postby Superdog » 08 Nov 2010 13:35

    I honestly thought the plot was a bit all over the place. I was definitely intrigued going forward from the opening parts but felt a little disappointed by how the plot unwound from there. I will say the ending scene with all the Immortals going insane and dying together in a big room with each other was very evocative.

    Did anyone else notice that Max Allgood=Duncan Idaho from God Emperor. They mentioned they keep cloning him and bringing him back so he can always be their head of security, but they always end up having to kill him.
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg (spoilers)

    Postby Apjak » 08 Nov 2010 14:34

    Superdog wrote:Did anyone else notice that Max Allgood=Duncan Idaho from God Emperor. They mentioned they keep cloning him and bringing him back so he can always be their head of security, but they always end up having to kill him.


    I think Omph mentions it in his book review.

    Omph is the reason I feel I can't go into much of a review on anything.
    I don't think the author should make the reader do that much work - Kevin J. Anderson
    We think we've updated 'Dune' for a modern readership without dumbing it down.- Brian Herbert
    There’s an unwritten compact between you and the reader. If someone enters a bookstore and sets down hard earned money(energy) for your book, you owe that person some entertainment and as much more as you can give. - Frank Herbert
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby Omphalos » 08 Nov 2010 14:44

    Don't let me stop you, man! There are plenty of things to talk about still, especially the stuff that people disagree with me about, and the stuff that I miss or get wrong! The more reviews the better everyone's understanding of the books is.

    http://www.omphalosbookreviews.com/inde ... s/info/465
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby Apjak » 09 Nov 2010 11:23

    This topic did start me on a search through various Bibliographies for the answer to a question.

    Was this the first novel he finished after Dune?

    I need to read a literary biography. (Something other than BH's DoD) I suspect that FH was the type of guy who couldn't stay focused on just one project at a time.

    Tim O'Reilly has the oneImage and he edited this Image

    Anyone know if they're any good?
    I don't think the author should make the reader do that much work - Kevin J. Anderson
    We think we've updated 'Dune' for a modern readership without dumbing it down.- Brian Herbert
    There’s an unwritten compact between you and the reader. If someone enters a bookstore and sets down hard earned money(energy) for your book, you owe that person some entertainment and as much more as you can give. - Frank Herbert
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby Freakzilla » 09 Nov 2010 11:53

    That Tim O'Riley one is more of a critical analysis than a biography, isn't it?
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg

    Postby Omphalos » 09 Nov 2010 13:07

    The closest thing that we have to a biography is BH's work on his dad, even though its more about his impressions of his dad and his life growing up in FH's household. The O'Reilly books are more in the vein of critical analysis. O'Reilly's hand is painfully obvious in the first book, but he kind of takes a step back out of the light in the second, The Maker of Dune. A book by a guy named Touponce kind of falls in the middle. All three have some biographical information about Herbert, but not very much. The best source for info about the man is the interviews. I wish there were more.

    HERE is a listing of Herbert's publications. Looks like The Green Brain was between Dune and Eyes, but I haven't scrutinized it to see if they were talking about magazine publication or paperback publication.
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    Re: The Eyes of Heisenberg (spoilers)

    Postby Ford4D » 26 Feb 2012 03:10

    Superdog wrote:Did anyone else notice that Max Allgood=Duncan Idaho from God Emperor. They mentioned they keep cloning him and bringing him back so he can always be their head of security, but they always end up having to kill him.


    I do remember noticing that, yes.

    This is one of the few Herbert novels I've read so far. I hope to one day read them all, because I have loved every single one so far!

    This was one of those Herbert novels I really wished there could have been a sequel or more books for. I just wanted to know more, see what would happen next.

    Frank has a way of doing that....
    Haven't read either of the Dune 7 books yet, so please don't spoil any details for me!
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