Discribe the BG!

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SadisticCynic
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SadisticCynic » 21 Apr 2009 10:52

I thought they wanted Sheeana because she would be a ridiculously powerful religious figure for their Missionaria Protectiva. But I think I see what you mean about 'breaking the GP'. They precipitated the destruction of Rakis along with (nearly) all the worms. Each worm carries a fraction (pearl) of Leto's awareness in it [wonder if each carried a copy of the whole; if so it would ruin my next comment :( ] and the destruction of most of these allows a greater distancing from Leto's prescient vision. However, one worm is saved and has a pearl of Leto's awareness in it. This pearl would, when propogated, regain the extent of prescient vision that was on Rakis. But humanity with the Siona gene aiding it would be so far dispersed by the time this happens that the vision will no longer encapsulate humanity: another brick is laid in the Path. :)

I imagine someone will come along and correct anything I've said that's wrong or just debunk the theory but until then...
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SandChigger » 21 Apr 2009 11:18

Basically they didn't understand the GP.

Another KH would be a "local" disaster at worst. ;)

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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 11:27

SwordMaster wrote:And that is brake the GP.


NO!!!

Can't be done!

I don't think YOU understand the GP completely.

The only way anyone could interfere would be to stop The Scatterng and hunt down and kill every human.

As long as there's a man and woman somewhere making babies, the GP endures.

All concerns in the last two books are only local.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SwordMaster » 21 Apr 2009 11:43

Freakzilla wrote:
SwordMaster wrote:And that is brake the GP.


NO!!!

Can't be done!

I don't think YOU understand the GP completely.

The only way anyone could interfere would be to stop The Scatterng and hunt down and kill every human.

As long as there's a man and woman somewhere making babies, the GP endures.

All concerns in the last two books are only local.


Yeah I think I do get the GP, Im trying to understand the motives of the sisterhood, thats where I lack understanding, I think Chigger said it with THEY did not understand the golden path. But I get the point of local concern, its just that quote

"Bell said there were no limits beyond which the Sisterhood would refuse to go in preserving the Bene Gesserit. A modicum of truth in this boast but it was the truth of all boasting. There were indeed things a Reverend Mother would not do to save the Sisterhood.
We would not block the Tyrant's Golden Path.
Survival of humankind took precedence over survival of the Sisterhood. Else our grail of human maturity is meaningless."


So that seems to sugest they knew of the GP but felt like they could de-rail it or something.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SandChigger » 21 Apr 2009 11:45

Somewhere in the Duniverse there's a woman has a baby every 2 seconds.

If the BG find her, they're gonna make the bitch CUT IT OUT.

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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 11:48

SwordMaster wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:
SwordMaster wrote:And that is brake the GP.


NO!!!

Can't be done!

I don't think YOU understand the GP completely.

The only way anyone could interfere would be to stop The Scatterng and hunt down and kill every human.

As long as there's a man and woman somewhere making babies, the GP endures.

All concerns in the last two books are only local.


Yeah I think I do get the GP, Im trying to understand the motives of the sisterhood, thats where I lack understanding, I think Chigger said it with THEY did not understand the golden path. But I get the point of local concern, its just that quote

"Bell said there were no limits beyond which the Sisterhood would refuse to go in preserving the Bene Gesserit. A modicum of truth in this boast but it was the truth of all boasting. There were indeed things a Reverend Mother would not do to save the Sisterhood.
We would not block the Tyrant's Golden Path.
Survival of humankind took precedence over survival of the Sisterhood. Else our grail of human maturity is meaningless."


So that seems to sugest they knew of the GP but felt like they could de-rail it or something.


Unless they know something we don't, I don't see how it could be derailed.

I don't know if I've talked about this here yet...

But there's only one way the GP could fail, that's if something halted The Scattering. If it somehow failed (infighting, biologicals, robot englobement fleet, etc...) someone like Teg could be a serious danger with his ability to see no-ships and, as I like to believe, no-people (Siona gene) then he could conceivably track everyone down.

Now, combine those abilities with Duncan and Sheeana's offspring...

:o
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Rakis » 21 Apr 2009 12:05

I always thought that Marty and Daniel had most of those powers (The Net), but with the GP, not powerful enough...

Wait, are you suggesting a threesome with Duncan, Teg and Sheeana to produce Uber offspring ?! :shock:
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 12:12

I imagine uber-face dancers could have derailed The Scattering, but I don't presume to know what "The Net" is.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 12:13

Rakis wrote:Wait, are you suggesting a threesome with Duncan, Teg and Sheeana to produce Uber offspring ?! :shock:


I was thinking more like Teg mating with Duncan and Sheeana's offspring.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 12:14

But all this talk of derailing the GP is HERESY!

A pox on your kind!
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby A Thing of Eternity » 21 Apr 2009 12:39

Freakzilla wrote:I imagine uber-face dancers could have derailed The Scattering, but I don't presume to know what "The Net" is.


Would tht really be getting in the way of the GP though? Depends on if we're going to consider those super FD human or not.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 13:07

A Thing of Eternity wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:I imagine uber-face dancers could have derailed The Scattering, but I don't presume to know what "The Net" is.


Would tht really be getting in the way of the GP though? Depends on if we're going to consider those super FD human or not.


I meant that the fighting between SFDs and HM could have put a halt on human expansion through the universe.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby A Thing of Eternity » 21 Apr 2009 13:33

Freakzilla wrote:
A Thing of Eternity wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:I imagine uber-face dancers could have derailed The Scattering, but I don't presume to know what "The Net" is.


Would tht really be getting in the way of the GP though? Depends on if we're going to consider those super FD human or not.


I meant that the fighting between SFDs and HM could have put a halt on human expansion through the universe.



Maybe, but it would have had to have been rediculously widespread. I think you're just doing the "for the sake of argument" thing though, we both doubt anything could have touched the GP/Scattering's expansion.
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Rakis » 21 Apr 2009 13:48

A Thing of Eternity wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:
A Thing of Eternity wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:I imagine uber-face dancers could have derailed The Scattering, but I don't presume to know what "The Net" is.


Would tht really be getting in the way of the GP though? Depends on if we're going to consider those super FD human or not.


I meant that the fighting between SFDs and HM could have put a halt on human expansion through the universe.



Maybe, but it would have had to have been rediculously widespread. I think you're just doing the "for the sake of argument" thing though, we both doubt anything could have touched the GP/Scattering's expansion.


Indeed, it was WAY to late to stop the GP...How can you catch up with 1,500 years of evolution ?

Wait a minute, i Know ! :shock:

Fucking light speed engines !!! :lol:
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 21 Apr 2009 14:28

I'm sure y'all know I'm not advocating the robot fleet englobing humanity.

No, it would have had to happen immediately after Anteac lead the Fish Speaker attack on IX.

As we all know, that didn't happen and no-tech was spread far and wide.

Besides, you can't "blockade" someone who can just jump through foldspace beyond the blockade.

:doh:
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SwordMaster » 21 Apr 2009 22:50

Freakzilla wrote:I'm sure y'all know I'm not advocating the robot fleet englobing humanity.

No, it would have had to happen immediately after Anteac lead the Fish Speaker attack on IX.

As we all know, that didn't happen and no-tech was spread far and wide.

Besides, you can't "blockade" someone who can just jump through foldspace beyond the blockade.

:doh:


so, why did the BG worry about "disrupting" the worm, and the GP?
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SwordMaster » 21 Apr 2009 22:57

and if I could also throw this out there now, there is an idea that could brake the GP and it is the theme of FH's 1st book, I know that most call me crazy for thinking that Frank would re-use this idea but it was one that he was very fond of: Superorganism.. dont read it wrong and make a sex joke! seriously I have always felt this was the final theme that FH would have used be the threat to the GP.

i have a whole crack pot theory and outline for dune 7 il post it sometime when im less high
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby A Thing of Eternity » 22 Apr 2009 02:19

That's one thing pinky and the brian did for us, made whatever crazy ideas we have for how it should have ended look good at least be comparision. :lol:
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Freakzilla » 22 Apr 2009 12:31

:obscene-smokingjoint:
harsh...

I think maybe a religion, like Sheeana's MP scheme could catch up with a lot of people and make it suck for a lot of people, maybe spread out from the core like a ripple in the scattering...

I just thought of that and it's better than fucking robots. :snooty:
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby trang » 22 Apr 2009 17:15

havent thought in depth of this in while, I would simply put the concern of the BG was Power for themselves. Up until Leto II they were working the Breeding program in all areas of human space.. to produce the KH that would be under their influence. They're KH would go where they couldnt...be many places at once? under their influence... pretty dam powerful jump for them. I believe that was their focus up to GEoD.

The unexpected development and arrival of Paul then Leto II, monkey wrenched they're plans. The GOD Emperor basically put them in a tupperware container and locked them down. His Tyrany forced the Golden Path, humanity scattering for survival, or escaping his reach. His passing and the scattering already happening... left a vaccum of power... The BG stepped up and moved forward. The HM, The Faction split in the BG, changed they're focus a bit, but still I think it circles back to that of simple power grasping for the BG.

Im over due for a reread anyway, best I can recollect at moment.

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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SwordMaster » 22 Apr 2009 18:43

Yeah but clearly as the quote says, a RM would never get in the way of the GP to save the BG

It hints towards them understanding the GP and protecting it
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SandChigger » 22 Apr 2009 18:47

But if they really understood it they wouldn't worry about whether it was still in effect, no?

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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SwordMaster » 22 Apr 2009 18:53

SandChigger wrote:But if they really understood it they wouldn't worry about whether it was still in effect, no?


You know how they are concerned about Sheeana dancing with the worms, and mating her with Duncan somehow disrupting the worms lingering lifespan, was it just to protect their hopes for another dune with natural spice production? I know when the BT saw they had a worm he was upset about loosing his big bargin chip of the man made spice...
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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby Schu » 22 Apr 2009 21:19

I thought the reason they were so fanatic about removing potential KH's (like quietly killing some of Odrade's children) was because that might interfere with the GP - same reason they were happy the Dune worms were killed (and once again, FUCK the new authors for saying they just burrowed!). Prescient entities may have gotten in the way of the GP since they create the future.

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Re: Discribe the BG!

Postby SandChigger » 22 Apr 2009 22:33

Um ... wasn't it more that another KH would probably get in the way of the BG? :shifty:


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