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Re: Other Memory

Posted: 08 Jan 2014 13:23
by BH
Serkanner wrote:Interestingly enough I was laughed off earlier in this topic (page 5) about me having a similar premises. Serkanner score!


Some of us continue to laugh.

Neener, neener!

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 08 Jan 2014 15:37
by Freakzilla
For the record, I didn't laugh. Well, not AT YOU. :lol:

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 09 Jan 2014 07:07
by Serkanner
:lol: ... Do we have a "smug" smiley?

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 09 Jan 2014 07:08
by Serkanner
BH wrote:
Serkanner wrote:Interestingly enough I was laughed off earlier in this topic (page 5) about me having a similar premises. Serkanner score!


Some of us continue to laugh.

Neener, neener!


Says the one who uses TheHacks' codpiece as a pacifier.

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 09 Jan 2014 13:17
by Freakzilla
Oops... :oops:

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 16 Jan 2014 18:02
by distrans
pacifier?!??!

as opposed to a chew ring thingeey...

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 07 Dec 2017 12:18
by distrans
In a letter to William Kennedy, Hunter Thompson confided that he was "coming to view the free enterprise system as the single greatest evil in the history of human savagery."[Hunter S. Thompson The Proud Highway, 1998, pg. 456.]


the bene gesserit mention that other memories provides the revelation of what savagery people are capable of and what great examples of it you have in your ancestry in order to be among the survivors of human evolution.

not sure how deep into history other memories extends but lets say its confined to that portion where language is used; say 80,000 years. that makes nearly 90% of them from hunter gather societys which would predominantly have been matriarchal

yet the pre-born kwisatz haderach only mention agriculturalists men used in alliance to keep the hordes of other memories at bay

was this a comment on where frank saw the peak of human despotism?

I don't remember paul mentioning any alliance
nor any reverend months needing help preserving their individuality from the female line

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 07 Dec 2017 14:07
by Freakzilla
distrans wrote:In a letter to William Kennedy, Hunter Thompson confided that he was "coming to view the free enterprise system as the single greatest evil in the history of human savagery."[Hunter S. Thompson The Proud Highway, 1998, pg. 456.]


the bene gesserit mention that other memories provides the revelation of what savagery people are capable of and what great examples of it you have in your ancestry in order to be among the survivors of human evolution.

not sure how deep into history other memories extends but lets say its confined to that portion where language is used; say 80,000 years. that makes nearly 90% of them from hunter gather societys which would predominantly have been matriarchal

yet the pre-born kwisatz haderach only mention agriculturalists men used in alliance to keep the hordes of other memories at bay

was this a comment on where frank saw the peak of human despotism?

I don't remember paul mentioning any alliance
nor any reverend months needing help preserving their individuality from the female line


I believe Leto II's OM went back to the original cell. I'm not sure how far back RM's go.

Bene Gesserit Reverend Mothers have what they call their Mohalata, a union of their benign ancestors that protect them from malignant ancestors.

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 07 Jan 2018 23:53
by pcqypcqy
Also, Paul was an adult (or nearly one) when he took the spice. Alia, Leto II and Ghanima were pre-born.

From memory, FH spends some time discussing this in CoD and/or GEoD, explaining how the overcame their other memories.

Part of the solution is that adults have their own identity, so are better at resisting posession.

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 08 Jan 2018 11:53
by georgiedenbro
Freakzilla wrote:Bene Gesserit Reverend Mothers have what they call their Mohalata, a union of their benign ancestors that protect them from malignant ancestors.


Where is the term Mohalata from? I don't remember it from my last read-through.

To be fair to what distrans wrote above, I do think there are indications in Messiah that Frank viewed bureaucracy as being the ultimate tyranny, and so there's an argument to be made that the OM referred to in CoD and GeoD saw male industrialists as being the peak of human despotism. There may have been malignant female ancestors, but for them to have been despots to a notable level they would have to have also had a system in place that was despotic. Hunter-gatherer societies most likely didn't have this kind of social machinery and so they were incapable of being despotic as a culture to the same extent that later human civilization could achieve.

Re: Other Memory

Posted: 08 Jan 2018 14:16
by Freakzilla
georgiedenbro wrote:
Freakzilla wrote:Bene Gesserit Reverend Mothers have what they call their Mohalata, a union of their benign ancestors that protect them from malignant ancestors.


Where is the term Mohalata from? I don't remember it from my last read-through.


It's first used in Children of Dune, Ghanima calls on it to protect her from Other Memory. It's used a couple of other times in that book as a Fremen term, not related to Other Memory. It's again used in Chapterhouse: Dune by Rebecca, Bellonda, and Murbella in reference to OM.