The Bene Gesserit in public opinion

Image
    One of the two remaining Great Schools tasked with mentoring humanity

Moderators: ᴶᵛᵀᴬ, Omphalos, Freakzilla

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 04 Mar 2008 20:59

I want to be the meat in a Lucilla - Sheeana sandwich.

:P

User avatar
orald
Posts: 3010
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 14:48
Location: Maximum Security Mental Hospital
Contact:

Postby orald » 04 Mar 2008 21:11

You're being cheap now.

I'd rather be in a Jessica-Alia-Irulan-Margot Fenring double sandwich. :twisted:
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.

I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 04 Mar 2008 21:24

^^^ I'll have what he's having, but with the Alia on the side.

The mother-daughter at the same time thing would creep me out.

User avatar
orald
Posts: 3010
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 14:48
Location: Maximum Security Mental Hospital
Contact:

Postby orald » 04 Mar 2008 21:32

I must have a strong stomach then. :P
I would've said Ghani too, but 5 would be overkill, and I already have 2 redheads.

So, uh, this is our image of the BG? Of how good a meal they would make?
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.



I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 04 Mar 2008 21:36

I don't think I ever really understood the topic.

Public opinion in the Duniverse or our universe? When?

In the pre-tyrant Duniverse they were mysterious witches and prefered to remain behind the scenes. They seemed like a finishing school for noble women.

Post-tyrant, they seem to be arbitrators and have stepped out from behind the scenes to guide humanity more directly. I think this is a function of their failure to harness their KH.

User avatar
Crysknife
Posts: 593
Joined: 09 Feb 2008 02:15
Location: SLC, punk

Postby Crysknife » 04 Mar 2008 21:43

Na, give me a Murbella, Alia, and Hwi combo, and supersize it baby!
Image

User avatar
orald
Posts: 3010
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 14:48
Location: Maximum Security Mental Hospital
Contact:

Postby orald » 04 Mar 2008 21:45

I don't think there's much to supersize on their part...you on the other hand... :twisted:

Hwi's so perfect she's annoying.
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.



I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

User avatar
Rakis
Posts: 1583
Joined: 16 Feb 2008 00:00

Postby Rakis » 04 Mar 2008 21:56

orald wrote:I don't think there's much to supersize on their part...you on the other hand... :twisted:

Hwi's so perfect she's annoying.


Yes, but she's the Ultimate Uber babe, Yaaaaa !
Image

loremaster
Posts: 220
Joined: 18 Feb 2008 04:24
Location: Leicester
Contact:

Postby loremaster » 05 Mar 2008 03:32

I found the description of Alia fighting naked against the training droid pretty hot. Plus she had attitude, (although she was otoh crazy).

Could go for Dama as the older woman, maybe? She must have some hella experience.
The HLP hasnt released Frank's notes yet, Brian hasn't got the handwriting quite right!

User avatar
orald
Posts: 3010
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 14:48
Location: Maximum Security Mental Hospital
Contact:

Postby orald » 05 Mar 2008 07:52

God Leto said the BG try to guide humanity, but due to being part of humanity themselves they're changed with it and have only a partial view and understanding of it, unlike himself with his complete OM and prescience.

"But the only people I have considered eliminating are the Bene Gesserit."
Her shock was too great for words.
"They are so close to what they should be and yet so far," he said.
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.



I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

User avatar
SandChigger
KJASF Ground Zero
Posts: 14490
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 22:29
Location: "Whatcha having, shoog? Hurry up and order now, I ain't got all day!"
Contact:

Postby SandChigger » 05 Mar 2008 13:21

Wasn't he more POed with them for not having seen or not acting to create the Golden Path, for seeking political power with their puppet KH on the throne instead of trying to preserve the species? Wasn't that how they failed to be "what they should"?

Freakzilla wrote:I don't think I ever really understood the topic.

Public opinion in the Duniverse or our universe? When?

Grrrr. I thought I explained this clearly enough in the OP. :?

;)
I have heard of only one mistake that doesn’t have an explanation for a careful reader...with an open mind. (And, no, I’m not going to tell you what it is!) —KJA

I don't like every writer's style; for instance, I have never been able to get through Ursula LeGuin, China Mieville, or Iain Banks, all of whom are critical darlings. —KJA

I...had written a bunch of Star Wars and X-Files books...that proved not just that I'm a hack, but that I could write in somebody else's universe... —KJA

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 05 Mar 2008 18:57

Sorry, I haven't been taking enough narcotics lately.

:cry:

User avatar
orald
Posts: 3010
Joined: 28 Feb 2008 14:48
Location: Maximum Security Mental Hospital
Contact:

Postby orald » 05 Mar 2008 23:26

I think the BG were trying to do right, but their shortcomings, meaning not having the powers of observation of a KH, led them astray.
They never knew how or what to do in a Golden Path, though clearly they've sensed something was wrong and something should've been done.
They just couldn't put their finger on those somethings.

Also, like I said, they themselves changed in time, which they didn't anticipate enough, a glaring oversight by their part.

Furthermore, I think, like Emperor Paul, they were bogged down and restricted by other powers.
God Leto in his infinite wisdom took over just about everything and steamrolled humanity to get his glorious GP underway.

All hail God Leto!
In memory of Perach, who suffered and died needlessly.



I wish I could have been with you that one last time.

User avatar
Spicelon
Posts: 703
Joined: 30 Mar 2008 23:31

Postby Spicelon » 31 Mar 2008 22:45

bumpity bump! I wanna play!

Going back to page 2ish or so, concerning the WoL and OM: Jessica and the Fremen RM, as well as Lucilla with the Lampadas Horde, gained those memories by Sharing, no? Isn't this a somewhat watered down form of undergoing the Spice Agony? It definitely seems to be a separate process altogether. My belief was that successfully becoming a RM unlocked the memories of female ancestry, so in effect they've been there the whole time, they just need a spice-induced kick to the head to get them active. Sharing, on the other hand, required no massive drug overdose.

The more I think about this, Sharing really muddies the OM picture. Spock would be proud, though. ;)
Poop is funny.
MetaCugel8262 is not.

User avatar
SandChigger
KJASF Ground Zero
Posts: 14490
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 22:29
Location: "Whatcha having, shoog? Hurry up and order now, I ain't got all day!"
Contact:

Postby SandChigger » 31 Mar 2008 23:05

Yeah, it REALLY does muddle it.

And Spock is right, too, since Sharing obviously involves T-P telepathy. (But not toilet paper!)

I still like the Shared OM in the brain, ancestral OM in the body theory; otherwise you have to imagine how all that information could be transferred from one body to another and then recorded in the recipient's DNA.

That would, IMO, make OM jump the shark. :D
I have heard of only one mistake that doesn’t have an explanation for a careful reader...with an open mind. (And, no, I’m not going to tell you what it is!) —KJA

I don't like every writer's style; for instance, I have never been able to get through Ursula LeGuin, China Mieville, or Iain Banks, all of whom are critical darlings. —KJA

I...had written a bunch of Star Wars and X-Files books...that proved not just that I'm a hack, but that I could write in somebody else's universe... —KJA

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Apr 2008 03:38

Sharing must be done in the in the of spice essence OR when death is imminent:

Odrade watched them from her chair behind the table. Those two had become like
a single person since yesterday's Sharing, not an unexpected occurrence.
Precedents were known, although not many of them. Exchanges, occurring in the
presence of poisonous spice essence or at an actual moment of death
, did not
often allow further living contact between participants. It was interesting to
observe. The two backs were oddly alike in their rigidity.

~CH:D
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Tleilax Master B
Posts: 674
Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:54
Location: Desert of New Mexico

Postby Tleilax Master B » 01 Apr 2008 08:46

SandChigger wrote:Yeah, it REALLY does muddle it.

And Spock is right, too, since Sharing obviously involves T-P telepathy. (But not toilet paper!)

I still like the Shared OM in the brain, ancestral OM in the body theory; otherwise you have to imagine how all that information could be transferred from one body to another and then recorded in the recipient's DNA.

That would, IMO, make OM jump the shark. :D


I'm with you on that one. No way to physically alter DNA post-sharing in the recipient.

Does shared OM later become part of ancestral OM in the offspring of the RM if said offspring undergoes the Agony? If so, that complicates matters......
Image

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Apr 2008 10:48

Tleilax Master B wrote:Does shared OM later become part of ancestral OM in the offspring of the RM if said offspring undergoes the Agony? If so, that complicates matters......


I don't think so, I don't remember it being mentioned. Alia got the SM from Ramallo but that was because she was in Jessica's womb.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Omphalos
Inglorious Bastard
Posts: 6635
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
Contact:

Postby Omphalos » 01 Apr 2008 10:57

I never thought so either. That just makes things way too complicated.

User avatar
Mandy
Cat Herder
Posts: 1700
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 20:18
Contact:

Postby Mandy » 01 Apr 2008 11:45

SM may not be passed through offspring but it survives by being shared again and again. I wonder what happens when you have an ancestral memory and a shared memory of the same person.. probably nothing, lol just a strange thought.

User avatar
Omphalos
Inglorious Bastard
Posts: 6635
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 11:07
Location: The Mighty Central Valley of California
Contact:

Postby Omphalos » 01 Apr 2008 12:18

Mandy wrote:SM may not be passed through offspring but it survives by being shared again and again. I wonder what happens when you have an ancestral memory and a shared memory of the same person.. probably nothing, lol just a strange thought.


It would be quite odd if you had two voices arguing about the real meaning of something, both of them from different "copies" of the same person, wouldnt it. I can see them now fighting to see who gets to say something during adab.

User avatar
Tleilax Master B
Posts: 674
Joined: 11 Feb 2008 10:54
Location: Desert of New Mexico

Postby Tleilax Master B » 01 Apr 2008 12:42

Omphalos wrote:
Mandy wrote:SM may not be passed through offspring but it survives by being shared again and again. I wonder what happens when you have an ancestral memory and a shared memory of the same person.. probably nothing, lol just a strange thought.


It would be quite odd if you had two voices arguing about the real meaning of something, both of them from different "copies" of the same person, wouldnt it. I can see them now fighting to see who gets to say something during adab.


Yeah, especially if they are women 8)
Image

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Apr 2008 14:02

Ghanima said Bene Gesserit training is primarily to prepare an acolyte for Other Memory.

It's bad enough arguing with your own voice in your head, not to mention all your ancestors and people you've Shared with, and who they shared with... and all their personal voices...

:shock:
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Mandy
Cat Herder
Posts: 1700
Joined: 08 Feb 2008 20:18
Contact:

Postby Mandy » 01 Apr 2008 15:18

Makes what Ghanima and Leto II did all the more amazing. It's no surprise that most pre-born go insane.

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18163
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Postby Freakzilla » 01 Apr 2008 15:34

Mandy wrote:Makes what Ghanima and Leto II did all the more amazing. It's no surprise that most pre-born go insane.


Exactly why they are called abomination and killed at birth. :wink:
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman


Return to “˱”