The agony

Image
    One of the two remaining Great Schools tasked with mentoring humanity

Moderators: ᴶᵛᵀᴬ, Omphalos, Freakzilla

Idaho Arkright
Posts: 3
Joined: 03 Feb 2012 03:32

The agony

Postby Idaho Arkright » 05 Feb 2012 22:00

Hi All
First time poster long time Dune fan. I thought the spice agony idea would be an
interesting topic. Specically I was wondering if
people think FH changed or at least evolved his idea
On the matter. In particular it seems that in the original Dune taking the water of
Life and gaining other memory was a very different experience then the later idea of "the agony." Jessica and Paul both seemed to have relatively pain free transformations, the key point was an ability to look within and
Change the nature of the poison allowing survival. In contrast later the fascinating idea of "the agony" and a trial by the most immense pain was introduced. Contradiction in thinking or rather just a deeper insight?

User avatar
JimmytheT
Posts: 33
Joined: 17 Nov 2011 12:10
Location: Alberta

Re: The agony

Postby JimmytheT » 05 Feb 2012 22:54

The change I noticed in the agony experienced by BG between Dune and Chapter House,was that when Jessica went through the agony, she only inherited the memories of preceeding Reverend Mothers; by the time of Heretics, aparently the BG have access to all female ancestral memories, not just Reverend Mothers.

EDIT - Oh and welcome by the way.
Your life story would not make a good book. Don't even try.
-Fran Lebowitz

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 05 Feb 2012 23:21

There is no "Agony" in Dune.

Lady Jessica experiences a pause in time while she transmutes the un-changed water of life.

Then, WHILE IN THE SPICE TRANCE she SHARES with the Fremen Reverend Mother Ramallo and accepts all the memories of her ancestors.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 05 Feb 2012 23:25

You want to hear my theory on WHY it's agonizing in the later books?

Probably not because I'm an asshole.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 05 Feb 2012 23:35

It's my theory that the 'agony' comes later because Leto II bred a sensitivity to spice into the Atreides. Take for example how Siona has prescient visions from just a few drops of Leto's... essence, hehe.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
SandRider
Watermaster
Posts: 6163
Joined: 05 Oct 2008 16:14
Location: In the back of your mind. Always.
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby SandRider » 06 Feb 2012 08:41

lemme guess ... you bet your mom's house on whoever it was what lost the SuperBowl,
started drinking around 2pm, ended up huffing paint thinner in the garage around midnight,
and thought you check-in at the sietch to "relax", right ?
................ I exist only to amuse myself ................
ImageImage

I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people.
~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008

User avatar
SandRider
Watermaster
Posts: 6163
Joined: 05 Oct 2008 16:14
Location: In the back of your mind. Always.
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby SandRider » 06 Feb 2012 08:51

all hail ming ....
................ I exist only to amuse myself ................
ImageImage

I personally feel that this message board, Jacurutu, is full of hateful folks who don't know
how to fully interact with people.
~ "Spice Grandson" (Bryon Merrit) 08 June 2008

Idaho Arkright
Posts: 3
Joined: 03 Feb 2012 03:32

Re: The agony

Postby Idaho Arkright » 06 Feb 2012 19:01

Ok yeh not the best written post. There is not really a question just pointing out inconsistency.
I agree what Jimmy wrote other memory also changed from just previous reverend mothers to all female ancestors.
Freak i don't think there is anything in geod suggesting Leto
II changed the nature of the spice experience to create the agony.
sand rider right on all accounts!... Well a least drinking 2am part


Introduction? American.. out of college for couple years now. From midwest travel a lot working in oil&gas
lately. Name obviously not Idaho though do like to go to Idaho! Great state. first read dune series
10 years or so ago re-reading now.

User avatar
SadisticCynic
Posts: 2022
Joined: 07 Apr 2009 09:28
Location: In Time or in Space?

Re: The agony

Postby SadisticCynic » 06 Feb 2012 19:41

Hi,

Arkright is an interesting name choice; what prompted it?

(This should really be in the Intro forum.)
Ah English, the language where pretty much any word can have any meaning! - A Thing of Eternity

Idaho Arkright
Posts: 3
Joined: 03 Feb 2012 03:32

Re: The agony

Postby Idaho Arkright » 06 Feb 2012 19:57

Hi
Cynic.
Name idea came from geod. Leto ii at one point talked about writing under a pseudonym... Noah Arkwright. Looks like I misspelled it when signing into forum but guess arkright is close enough to get the idea

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 07 Feb 2012 13:05

SandRider wrote:lemme guess ... you bet your mom's house on whoever it was what lost the SuperBowl,
started drinking around 2pm, ended up huffing paint thinner in the garage around midnight,
and thought you check-in at the sietch to "relax", right ?


Something like that... there was excessive drinking involved, starting at 12:01 PM.

The police came later that night (early the next morning?) but I didn't get arrested.

From what I remember they just wanted to express to me how impressed they were by my little 50W Sony bookself speakers.

Sorry for getting belligerent in your topic, Idaho.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 14 Mar 2012 19:50

I deleted evidence of my belligerence in some above posts because his was actually a good question...

I also edited some of my more lucid comments that were actually germane.

:obscene-drinkingdrunk:

I normally don't delete or edit posts, but hey, they were mine. So, :obscene-birdiedoublegreen:
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
Freakzilla
Lead Singer and Driver of the Winnebego
Posts: 18157
Joined: 05 Feb 2008 01:27
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
Contact:

Re: The agony

Postby Freakzilla » 14 Mar 2012 19:55

Idaho Arkright wrote:Freak i don't think there is anything in geod suggesting Leto II changed the nature of the spice experience to create the agony.


I wasn't suggesting he changed the nature of the experience but increased the people in his breeding program's sensitivity to spice. This would also be important during The Famine Times.
Image
Paul of Dune was so bad it gave me a seizure that dislocated both of my shoulders and prolapsed my anus.
~Pink Snowman

User avatar
lotek
Posts: 5735
Joined: 28 Jul 2009 08:33

Re: The agony

Postby lotek » 15 Mar 2012 09:58

Idaho Arkright wrote:Hi All
First time poster long time Dune fan. I thought the spice agony idea would be an interesting topic.
Specically I was wondering if people think FH changed or at least evolved his idea on the matter.
In particular it seems that in the original Dune taking the water of Life and gaining other memory was a very different experience then the later idea of "the agony."
Jessica and Paul both seemed to have relatively pain free transformations, the key point was an ability to look ithin and change the nature of the poison allowing survival.
In contrast later the fascinating idea of "the agony" and a trial by the most immense pain was introduced. Contradiction in thinking or rather just a deeper insight?


now that's a better read, what's with the weird paragraph choices ?
Spice is the worm's gonads.


Return to “˱”