"Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

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"Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandChigger » 10 Apr 2009 10:58

Saw this posted by Andrew over on FED2K:

Enforcers of Dune: Frank Herbert Estate Targets Dune Roleplayers In Second Life

So this is perhaps the first publicly confirmed case of an SL roleplay group finding itself under fire for alleged IP rights violations. In any case, Vooper Werribee does not dispute Trident's right to file such a notice, though he finds it "quite intriguing how this has manifested itself in a somewhat obscure setting when as far as I can see Star Wars and Star Trek-based roleplay sims do not seem to have suffered the same intellectual property enforcement." Then again, both of those franchises have a history of allowing their fans to create derivative works, as long as it's not defamatory, and no profit is made.

Business as usual. They never stop, do they?

At Herbert Lactic Products, our motto is "FUCK THE FANS!"


(Can't remember anyone here ever expressing interest in or saying they participate in SL, so it's not that relevant, except as a further example of the HLP abuse of fans.)

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Postby TheDukester » 10 Apr 2009 11:15

This is what the HLP spends its time on.

Not hiring a writer who isn't the world's foremost hack.

Not taking steps to protect and promote the legacy of Frank Herbert, the man who made their annual paychecks possible.

Not working with reputable publishers to produced new Dune items.

No ... they go after a few dozen online role-players.

Pathetic and just plain wrong.
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Postby SandRider » 10 Apr 2009 11:25

I'm still waiting for the DuneFish to get a cease & desist order on the Dune Font site .....
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Postby Mr. Teg » 10 Apr 2009 11:45

SandRider wrote:I'm still waiting for the DuneFish to get a cease & desist order on the Dune Font site .....


The HLP doesn't own the rights to the typeface used for past Dune books.
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Postby TheDukester » 10 Apr 2009 11:48

SandRider wrote:I'm still waiting for the DuneFish to get a cease & desist order on the Dune Font site .....

Knowing the dim-bulbs at the HLP, they are equally likely to try to shut down his user ID.

"Cease and desist! You can't use that word!"
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Postby DuneFishUK » 10 Apr 2009 12:30

TheDukester wrote:
SandRider wrote:I'm still waiting for the DuneFish to get a cease & desist order on the Dune Font site .....

Knowing the dim-bulbs at the HLP, they are equally likely to try to shut down his user ID.

"Cease and desist! You can't use that word!"


Eh...heh..heh... yeah.

They did do that. :P

Fuckers.

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Nekhrun » 10 Apr 2009 13:16

SandChigger wrote:Saw this posted by Andrew over on FED2K:

Enforcers of Dune: Frank Herbert Estate Targets Dune Roleplayers In Second Life

So this is perhaps the first publicly confirmed case of an SL roleplay group finding itself under fire for alleged IP rights violations. In any case, Vooper Werribee does not dispute Trident's right to file such a notice, though he finds it "quite intriguing how this has manifested itself in a somewhat obscure setting when as far as I can see Star Wars and Star Trek-based roleplay sims do not seem to have suffered the same intellectual property enforcement." Then again, both of those franchises have a history of allowing their fans to create derivative works, as long as it's not defamatory, and no profit is made.

Business as usual. They never stop, do they?

At Herbert Lactic Products, our motto is "FUCK THE FANS!"


(Can't remember anyone here ever expressing interest in or saying they participate in SL, so it's not that relevant, except as a further example of the HLP abuse of fans.)

My 2nd life player still resides in the Dune area. I started an account last year to see what it was all about, I made it that far and then never went back.

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby GamePlayer » 10 Apr 2009 18:22

Wow? Legal action? What a bunch of assholes. I hope the SL group tells the HLP to fuck right off.
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandChigger » 10 Apr 2009 20:13

No, I believe they've already made the required name changes, etc.

They're keeping the area, evidently, but going to use it for other things. (Something about a Star Wars-angle spice mine? First contact training area? Who knows.)
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby GamePlayer » 10 Apr 2009 20:37

That's unfortunate.
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Omphalos » 10 Apr 2009 22:01

SandChigger wrote:No, I believe they've already made the required name changes, etc.

They're keeping the area, evidently, but going to use it for other things. (Something about a Star Wars-angle spice mine? First contact training area? Who knows.)


That's the cheap way of handling it.

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Redstar » 10 Apr 2009 22:28

GamePlayer wrote:Wow? Legal action? What a bunch of assholes. I hope the SL group tells the HLP to fuck right off.

One of these days, someone will. And I'd just love it if they were pissed off enough to go through with it all the way.

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Dune Nerd » 10 Apr 2009 22:30

Is there a worse managed group than this one?

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Tleszer » 10 Apr 2009 22:46

Dune Nerd wrote:Is there a worse managed group than this one?


No need to spit in the wind...
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby TheDukester » 10 Apr 2009 22:48

Dune Nerd wrote:Is there a worse managed group than this one?

AIG? Maybe? I don't know; it's close ...
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Freakzilla » 11 Apr 2009 07:44

Just when you start to think they couldn't sink any lower...
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandChigger » 11 Apr 2009 08:44

Nah, there's plenty of bottom they've yet to plumb.

:o

Ooh.
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby Nekhrun » 11 Apr 2009 10:03

SandChigger wrote:Nah, there's plenty of bottom they've yet to plumb.

:o

Ooh.

Agreed, as long as there is someone in the world who still likes Dune they will be there to make sure the fire goes out. I wonder if it's all part of some master plan to make people value FH even more that they have to find new ways to fuck up his creation and say, "No one's as good as he was."
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandRider » 11 Apr 2009 11:27

SandChigger wrote:Nah, there's plenty of bottom they've yet to plumb.

:o

Ooh.


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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandChigger » 11 Apr 2009 12:07

Yea! Someone got it!

You get me, you really really get me! :lol:
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SadisticCynic » 11 Apr 2009 12:11

Oh no, I just got it! (need a face-palm smiley)
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby cmsahe » 11 Apr 2009 22:59

Byron, Brian and Kevin you are idiots!! you have lawyers threatening all the fans of Dune, that's why you got deleted the Dune Encyclopedia that I had uploaded to a documents sharing server:
Dear cmsahe,
We have removed your document "Dune Encyclopedia" as a result of a third-party notification that it holds the copyright and has not given permission for it to appear on Scribd.com.

If you believe the takedown is improper, you are welcome to contact us at copyright@scribd.com and provide us with the information described at <a href="http://www.scribd.com/copyright">http://www.scribd.com/copyright</a>

As stated in our terms of use, repeated incidents of copyright infringement will result in the deletion of your Scribd.com account and prohibit you from uploading material to Scribd.com in the future. To prevent us from having to take these steps, please delete from scribd.com any material you have uploaded to which you do not own the necessary rights and refrain from uploading any material you are not entitled to upload. For more information about Scribd.com's copyright policy, please read the Terms of Use located at http://www.scribd.com/terms

Sincerely,

Jason Bentley
Directory of Community Development
jason@scribd.com


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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandChigger » 12 Apr 2009 04:14

Did the HLP purchase the copyright for the Encyclopedia from McNelly or his widow? Do they own it? They aren't specifically named in the message. You're assuming something that may not be true.

Either way, whoever owns the rights, it isn't you, Carlos. Sorry, but I don't see much similarity between what you did and what this Second Life group was doing. You simply uploaded content which you hold no rights to. But the SL group put a lot of effort into creating original secondary content based on primary material which they had no rights to. So I don't think you have much basis for your indignation.

Anyway, the message quite clearly states what Scribd can do to you: if you continue to upload material you don't own the copyright to, they'll delete your account and most likely try to block you from creating a new one.

If you're just printing up a few T-shirts using copyrighted images for your own personal use, you probably won't get caught, but if you start selling them, you could get into some real trouble.

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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby SandRider » 12 Apr 2009 13:15

shit, Chigger, what do you consider "real trouble" ?

I'm almost sympathetic to copyright bullshit if someone
is turning profit on something. Posting an unavailable,
out of print, almost cultish document on the net seems
well within "fair use" to me, and if the HLP lawyers disagree,
fuck them.

and to the HLP lawyers: fuck you. quit fronting and
sue somebody. "You better stop touching me, or I'm
going to tell Mom !" :teasing-poke:




SadisticCynic wrote:Oh no, I just got it! (need a face-palm smiley)

:doh:
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Re: "Herbert Estate" shuts down SL Dune RP Group

Postby cmsahe » 12 Apr 2009 15:09

I agree with Sandrider, what's wrong with sharing the DE?(my downloaded PDF copy, uploaded my someone else before me.) An out of print, very difficult to get book? I think that it was the HLP that asked scribd and other servers to delete it, because it's a source of contradiction and conflict with the new Dune canon. The reasons given me by scribd are laughable, they have thousands of copyrighted books (i.e. very useful "for Dummies" books.), Take a look. Then i wonder, why don't they delete those books (yes, yes, I understand and clearly reject the illegal reproduction of copyrighted material. For instance my collection of classic Doctor Who is all original, even though I know where I could download the episodes from)

You gave me an idea, to print and sell t-shirts with the legend "I was banned from Dune Novels" (I'm just kidding, I imagine the looks of the people: "What is this nerd referring to?") :)

BTW (now that this SL group was closed down) I wonder if we are not endangered...


SandChigger wrote:Did the HLP purchase the copyright for the Encyclopedia from McNelly or his widow? Do they own it? They aren't specifically named in the message. You're assuming something that may not be true.

Either way, whoever owns the rights, it isn't you, Carlos. Sorry, but I don't see much similarity between what you did and what this Second Life group was doing. You simply uploaded content which you hold no rights to. But the SL group put a lot of effort into creating original secondary content based on primary material which they had no rights to. So I don't think you have much basis for your indignation.

Anyway, the message quite clearly states what Scribd can do to you: if you continue to upload material you don't own the copyright to, they'll delete your account and most likely try to block you from creating a new one.

If you're just printing up a few T-shirts using copyrighted images for your own personal use, you probably won't get caught, but if you start selling them, you could get into some real trouble.
Only the books written by Frank Herbert are canon.


Who We Are and What We Stand For
http://www.jacurutu.com/viewtopic.php?p=79778#p79778
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Carlos Santillan, aka cmsahe